[NewCandle] Schlicher 'drive'

Mon Sep 29 14:37:08 EDT 2008

Hi Gents,

I just browsed PAIR for information about the patent in question,
US5142861. Here's the direct link to the patent text on USPTO
( Johns link has timed out, but this form of link won't ).

http://patft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?patentnumber=5142861

Here's the last known contact address for Rex Schlicher

REX L. SCHLICHER
7400 GEORGETOWN AVENUE NW
ALBUQUERQUE NM 87120-1628

I see from the PAIR system that he paid his 4,8, & 12 year
fees on time. That means the patent is still in force, and relevant
to this group, it means he still believes in his results enough to
plunk down those substantial fees. That's a positive sign.

AS Kyle mentioned, NASA made an attempt to reproduce the claims,
with no success. You can read about that here.

http://gltrs.grc.nasa.gov/citations/all/tm-2001-211207.html

If you follow the link, there is a PDF document at the end of the
page that gives details about the replication attempt. Perhaps
Kyle can comment on the picture on page 5; does it look like Johns
antenna? What is the prism conductor that you mention? Does that
mean the conductor cross section has edges?

I'll probably regret this (grin), but Rex has a listed number.
Here it is.

(505) 839-9397

It might be worth a call to Rex if one or more of us tries
to replicate this work, or perhaps before a replication to
get some idea about his current thinking on the subject.

I seem to remember getting a copy of this patent some time ago in
conjunction with my employment. It reminded me of a claim made
to me a very long time ago ( would be in the mid 80's ) by a
young physicist/inventor. He was promoting the idea that you
could achieve EM thrust with a phased antenna array. Basically,
he was looking at the amperian force between two conductors
when the stimulus was _very_ hf AC. With the proper phasing,
there was a unidirectional force. In practice, the required
antenna structure and drive frequency/currents were almost
unachievable for a substantial thrust. So no real experimental
attempts happened. But this work did remind me of that idea.

I think the first hurdle to overcome with this device
is the potential for stray inductances and eddy currents to
permit a reaction force. The fact that you can't practically
suspend the whole apparatus, power supply and all, makes this
a challenging project. My other concern would be ionic propulsion.
When you are dealing with fast risetime pulses at these
magnitudes the dynamic voltage gradients can become quite intense.
Enough to cause ionic emission, and if pointy cross sectioned
conductors are necessary you can sort of see how it would be
of concern. I have struggled with this problem in my own work
with pulsed current driving inductors, so I would be expecting
similar problems here.

I think both concerns could be addressed by the use of a dummy
antenna that shows null results. Given that the prior replicators
got null results with their antenna, that one would be a good
null standard.

As far as drivers go, I do like the transformer system described
by Kyle. I've done plenty of big pulse circuits with caps, and while
they are great for some things they aren't so hot for loads that
require a continuous train of pulsed DC. As Nick mentioned, a hydrogen
thyratron would be a great switch for a cap based circuit. I
do have one but I haven't ever bothered to wire the thing up
( this is not a trivial task ). Spark gaps are great but triggering
them is again not a trivial task, and they don't turn off unless
your pulse forming network is designed to do the job. I have built
various kinds of these self extinguishing pulse forming circuits, some good
to about
20KV, but the net effect would be a sort of relaxation oscillator so the
pulses
would be quite far apart w/ respect to their pulse width.

All that said, Kyle, how did you smoke the car battery? I'm guessing you
didn't provide enough of a resistive load in the primary, or perhaps
you didn't handle the huge back EMF when your relays opened the
transformer primary with all that current...

I would _not_ give up on the car battery idea. A low voltage high power FET
would
be able to do the switching and with enough of a ballasting load
you could do it safely. In fact, the driver John described to you
sounds like the best overall approach; with a few tweaks we could
probably get you going on that.

K.

-----Original Message-----
From: newcandle-bounces at ipdiscover.com
[mailto:newcandle-bounces at ipdiscover.com]On Behalf Of Nick Reiter
Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 8:45 AM
To: New energy for the new world.
Subject: Re: [NewCandle] Schlicher 'drive'

Hi Kyle,

First of all, my belated condolences on John's
passing.  I had no idea.  I guess I confess I had not
kept close tabs on Vo or other lists for quite some
time.  If it was mentioned here, I apologize that it
must have slipped past me.

Driving shaped pulses at kilo-amps sounds like a job
for a capacitive discharge with either an adjustable
spark gap or a hydrogen thyratron trigger.  Thats
about all I can conceive of as being able to do that!
Something that might work as a can-crusher or wire
exploder could work here, although the rep rate or
"frequency" would be mighty slow.  I'd opt for the
spark gap myself.

Any and all pics are appreciated - please post a link
here.  If you have kept a website of your own, I may
have seen it wayyy back in Vortex times, but thats
been a while.

Best,

nr

>
> Alright, this might be a bit lengthy, so I apologize
> in advance for
> that. I'll try to answer the questions that Nick
> posed, and explain a
> bit more of what (little) I know about the monster
> in the attic.
> (well...one of my many monsters)
>
> First off, the patent on USPTO is (if I remember
> right) corrupt. There's
> a couple pages that are duplicated, and a couple not
> included at all.
> The whole thing can be obtained from Google patents,
> with the originally
> left-out pages there. I don't know if Schlicher's
> theory is correct or
> not. I'm not very theoretically minded, I just tend
> to want to apply
> current and let the thing do its business. Anyone
> here able to comment
> on that?
>
> I DO have a copy of Schlicher's paper submitted to
> the AIAA. I don't
> know exactly how legal it is for me to post it, as I
> did pay for it. But
> if there's a request to just...you know...peek at
> it...
>
> I know about the Stavros Dmitriou thing. I don't
> know if the effect is
> related. It might be. Stavros' thing was much lower
> current, and much
> higher frequency, if I recall right. Schlicher's
> thing uses kA's of
> current, at some cycles per second. Exactly WHAT
> cycles per second, I
> don't know. Comments on that to follow below...
>
> As far as John Schnurer loaning me the driver,
> that's impossible.
> Unfortunately, he died last May. He had a long, hard
> fight with
> Parkinsons, and apparently was overdosed with
> medication. It reacted
> badly, and he (as far as anyone will tell me) had a
> massive heart
> attack. His posting style on Vortex reflects the
> progression of the
> disease. I knew him since 1998. He was a very good
> friend, and taught me
> many things. He even mailed me the Schlicher antenna
> that I have.
>

The Holy Grail 'neath ancient Roslin waits.
The blade and chalice guarding o'er Her gates.
Adorned in the masters' loving art, She lies;
She rests at last beneath the starry skies.

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